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Bad Adder Publicity: |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351  View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 27 Aug 2003 Before reading the following take a deep breath... 
Ok, apart from the obvious bad publicity that this story represents I am interested in several things: Rushenden is on the Isle of Sheppy. Adder have never been recorded from the isle. Indeed, the closest known record is on the other side of the creek, some 10 km away. In Kent, adder are most closely associated with chalk grassland and woodland edges (on chalk). If this is indeed a genuine adder record it is really quite important. The area is known to support a very good population of grass snake. The comment 'it was a really big snake...' may be telling here. '...after he showed her the puncture wounds...' Although grass snake can bite I don't know anybody who has ever been bitten. I have been bitten twice by slow-worm (but I have handled hundreds of animals) and I know of other instances where slow-worm have drawn blood. I doubt that either grass snake or slow-worm would leave puncture wounds - although either species could draw blood and leave a 'mark'. Thoughts? '...felt dizzy after being bitten...' Perhaps a little shock, may be a dry bite (if it was an adder). The newspaper did not consult with KRAG or (as far as I can tell) the local wildlife trust. We have responded to similar sensationalist stories in the past so they should have our details on file. Now before I get on my high horse and sound off at the newspaper (which I will in a constructive way), I wondered what other people think, particularly with regard to verified grass snake bites. Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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Gemma Fairchild Krag Committee Joined: 14 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 193 View other posts by Gemma Fairchild |
Posted: 27 Aug 2003 Hi Lee, I've not been bitten by a grass snake, BUT! Did once have one draw blood unintentionally. It went into typical feigned death mode as I was carrying it back to my field bag for measurement, I allowed the animals teeth to graze my hand as I was walking. Just pinpricks but it did bleed quite convincingly. As in my experience they often feign death when caught (after the perfuming attempt) this might make some sense here. I wonder if the lad smelt a bit strange when he got home? 
Symptoms such as feeling sick afterwards, could just be related to shock, would be interesting to hear if adders really do exist in the area. The marks persisted for a couple of days afterwards. ----RAUK e-Forum---- 
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Alan Hyde Senior Member Joined: 17 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 1416 View other posts by Alan Hyde |
Posted: 27 Aug 2003 Yup , IMO it's a grassy . I've caught many many grassies and never been bitten , but I have been bitten on two seperate occasions when handling natrix in Turkey . It does say that the boy was 'playing' with the snake in the grass . I think he probably provoked it untill it did bite. Alan O-> O+> |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 27 Aug 2003 A KRAG recorder has contacted me to say that slow-worm are also very abundant in this area. They apparently get 'a bit abused' by the locals 
Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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Wolfgang Wuster Senior Member Joined: 23 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 326 View other posts by Wolfgang Wuster |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 I've never been bitten by a grass snake, but I have been bitten by one or two other snakes that, according to the books, never ever bite - Cylindrophis ruffus is one I remember clearly, since it has aroused immense hilarity with any colleague to whom I have mentioned it. Funnily enough, after that, I never took up the Thai Red Cross people's offer to have a few Bungarus fasciatus draped around my neck, witht he assurance that they "never ever bite in the daytime". The point of it all is, since grass snakes are physically capable of biting, it seems perfectly plausible that this was indeed a grass snake. The fact that the bite didn't hurt also points in that direction. Cheers, Wolfgang Lee Brady: Can you make out the bite marks in the original newspaper article? Wolfgang Wüster School of Biological Sciences, University of Wales, Bangor http://sbsweb.bangor.ac.uk/~bss166/ |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Another KRAG recorder who used to live in the area has also reported seeing lots of grass snake but certainly no adder. Lots of new development in the area in recent years apparently. Wolfgang: the newspaper photo is no clearer than the jpeg. It rather amused me to see a photo in the paper of a kid holding out his 'puncture wounds', when in fact there is nothing to see!! Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 I should also point out that the Isle of Sheppy is on London clay. Adders and clay are not a happy mix... Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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Tony Phelps Forum Specialist Joined: 09 Mar 2003 No. of posts: 575 View other posts by Tony Phelps |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 I have been bitten by gras snakes a few times, all have been big females over a metre. I do recall that the wounds, which bled freely, itched like mad for a day or so. We get adders on clay here in Purbeck by the way, one of my oldest sites is an old china clay working. Tony |
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Martin Senior Member Joined: 23 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 87 View other posts by Martin |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Surely the truth won't matter in a case like this. The article has been printed and the decisions made, I would find it hard to believe that the paper would be interested in putting the story straight. I can nearly see the headline for it now - "Boy Didn't Get Bitten by Anything Harmful." Hardly the words to help sell a paper... (Publicity, don't you just love it.) Martin. |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Although I agree the paper probably doesn't care about the truth, I think that it is important to get a letter in the same paper to put the record straight. Articles like this often generate a large amount of feedback from concerned local residents. Hopefully, more reasonable people who read a KRAG letter in the paper will refrain from butchering grass snake and slow-worm. I would be very surprised if they did not print a well reasoned letter. It is an opportunity for KRAG to publicise the plight of the adder in Kent and attempt to turn the article around. We'll see. Tony: I should have said adders and clay are not a happy mix in Kent, see my new thread on adders on clay
Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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-LAF Senior Member Joined: 03 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 317 View other posts by -LAF |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Hmmm, would be great to see a proper picture of the bite. It certainly sounds like nothing more than a bit of shock to me. Still, publicity wise the damage has undoubtedly already been done. At least the lad's still kicking. Cheers, Lee. Lee Fairclough |
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Martin Senior Member Joined: 23 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 87 View other posts by Martin |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Calumma, go for it. Please keep us posted.
Martin |
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j gaughan Senior Member Joined: 04 May 2003 No. of posts: 57 View other posts by j gaughan |
Posted: 29 Aug 2003 hello all first of all, thanks wolfgang for your advice on an earlier thread _ a related issue now, i've had the pleasure of been 'bitten' by all our terrestial reptiles, minus the one that counts; once each by a slow-worm & grass snake, the later being a 2' female, angry with being unearthed early from hibernation which was just below the surface under a log pile, while we cleared ground for another outdoor viv. ; she hissed & struck wildy (adder-like), drawing blood on my hand, but nothing compared to what a ladder snake did in the south of france once sounds like grass snake to me unless it was a big, fat angry Anguis _'''they never bite'' i told a little girl holding one for the first time at a reptile show ('lizard day' at frensham 3 yrs ago), then it slowly bit into her finger just like a smooth snake; luckily she was alright about it and joined her friends in laughter my 'bite' came when i grabbed 5 or 6 in the same hand that were under a mattress i was holding up with my other arm _rescued off a dorset heath, now a housing estate, 20-odd yrs ago it's an important part of our role, to guide the people of the press to a new and enlightened 21st century view of herps, hopfully educating them and in turn their readership, in the mainstream; as for bats & spiders . . . i was passed an article from the 'daily mail' for sat. 16th aug. which was well illustrated (life-size adder pic.) with a positive text, quoteing jim foster, but still the usual headline: 'Beware snakes! _Serpents slither out in the heatwave . . . including the poisonous adder' out of interest lee, what was the 'headline' to that biting story john |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 29 Aug 2003 Yes I should have included the headline in the original post. It was: 'I'll steer clear of snakes says Matt, after adder bites' They did include an 'Adder fact file' with mostly ok information - looks like it was pulled off the web somewhere. Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
- Bad Adder Publicity |