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Smooth snake bite: |
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Tony Phelps Forum Specialist Joined: 09 Mar 2003 No. of posts: 575  View other posts by Tony Phelps |
Posted: 21 Jul 2003 Picked up one of my large male smooth snakes today and in usual manner, after a minute or so, he started chewing on my finger. When I returned home, about two hours later, my finger was stiff and noticeably swollen and right now is also very tender. This is a first for me, just wondered, if Dave or anybody had had similar. Tony |
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-LAF Senior Member Joined: 03 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 317 View other posts by -LAF |
Posted: 22 Jul 2003 Hi Tony, am finally back in Notts now (boo!) but just have to say WOW!, thankyou for taking the time out on Saturday to show me around. Yesterday I went back to some forestry commision land near Wareham and saw all six of our native reptiles - and who says smooth snakes don't bask openly? I saw 3 in as many days coiled up basking in pretty conspicuous places, all around 10-11am. Am gonna post all the pics soon on a new website. Anyway, back to the bite, as you know C. austriaca do have duvernoy's glands so I don't see why they can't produce something toxic. Rhabdophis don't have proper venom glands, just duvernoy's, yet they're still nasty little begggers. Of course, the interesting question now is whether there is something actively toxic in their saliva or if you've just had a bit of an allergic reaction. Cheers, Lee. Lee Fairclough |
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Wolfgang Wuster Senior Member Joined: 23 Apr 2003 No. of posts: 326 View other posts by Wolfgang Wuster |
Posted: 22 Jul 2003 Coronella almost certainly has various post-synaptic neurotoxins, among other things, like most other colubrines. Practicaly all colubrids have venom glands ("Duvernoy's glands") producing a variety of nasties - most of the time, nothing gets into the wound, but once in a while, you may get a bit of an effect. This is the first time I have heard of a symptomatic Coronella bite, though - very interesting. Cheers, Wolfgang Wolfgang Wüster School of Biological Sciences, University of Wales, Bangor http://sbsweb.bangor.ac.uk/~bss166/ |
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David Bird Forum Specialist Joined: 17 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 515 View other posts by David Bird |
Posted: 22 Jul 2003 I have had numerous bites and only a couple have been slightly tender the next day the others were not really felt or tooth marks even visible after about 12 hours. I did have one on a BHS survey day, with an audience of herpetologists, that bled for about 20 minutes and not just a seepage but a good flow. The only permanent problem was the earache caused by laughing colleagues. All reptile teeth have a good coating of bacteria and one wonders how some of these can produce local irritation in some bites or if some of the teeth or parts of them can be left in the skin. I certainly have had problems with itching bites from Bull snakes that improved when teeth were forced out of the healed over tooth mark. British Herpetological Society Librarian and member of B.H.S Conservation Committee. Self employed Herpetological Consultant and Field Worker. |
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Tony Phelps Forum Specialist Joined: 09 Mar 2003 No. of posts: 575 View other posts by Tony Phelps |
Posted: 22 Jul 2003 As you can imagine getting bitten by smooth snakes is almost a daily thing for me, that is why I commented. Just to say now, that finger is still swollen and tender, but no other symptoms other than local, including 'pins & needles' on back of hand, so maybe not so local. Had five basking smooth snakes this morning (0830) plus the same number of basking slow worms. Tony |
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Caleb Forum Coordinator Joined: 17 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 448 View other posts by Caleb |
Posted: 22 Jul 2003 I had a largeish smooth snake bite me on a J'Herp camp in Dorset many years ago. Someone dropped the snake, I caught it in mid-air, and it bit me. It had a good chew, as I thought it was best to let it get on with it, rather than try to force it off... The bite marks were still visible the next day, but there was no swelling, tenderness, or any other symptoms. |
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Tony Phelps Forum Specialist Joined: 09 Mar 2003 No. of posts: 575 View other posts by Tony Phelps |
Posted: 22 Jul 2003 Hi Lee, Could you e mail the location of your SS sightings; i.e. the ones after we parted. Cheers Tony |
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j gaughan Senior Member Joined: 04 May 2003 No. of posts: 57 View other posts by j gaughan |
Posted: 29 Aug 2003 hello all i've had a similar bite reaction once as david describes, though my audience were trustees and MOD officials; before joining the group, an otherwise placid male slowly bit both hands, which i didn't remove straight away; around 15 mins. later i was still wiping both hands on my shorts as the blood, although small amounts, was still flowing; no other symptoms but i do remember thinking how odd it was at the time john |
- Smooth snake bite |