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slow worm bith rates: |
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jopedder Senior Member Joined: 24 Jul 2003 No. of posts: 55  View other posts by jopedder |
Posted: 01 Aug 2003 I am currently assisting in a population estimate of slow worms on a site marked for development in Bishop's Stortford, we have nearly finished the neccessary visits for our data on the population, but we know that the reptiles will have bred by the time we perform the relocation of the animals. I need to find out how productive this species is, so that we can modify our data accordingly. Any ideas? Many thanks Jo |
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David Bird Forum Specialist Joined: 17 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 515 View other posts by David Bird |
Posted: 01 Aug 2003 The slow-worm may gives birth to an average of about 10 babies but this does obviously depend on the sizes of the females you have and the food available to them on the site British Herpetological Society Librarian and member of B.H.S Conservation Committee. Self employed Herpetological Consultant and Field Worker. |
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betty Member Joined: 28 Aug 2003 No. of posts: 3 View other posts by betty |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Young females (SVL approx 120- 150 mm) often don't produce more than six to eight juveniles per clutch. Larger females, approaching 200mm SVL, and produce up to 26. The maximum I observed in three years of study was 19. Incidentally, neonates born on the new site seem to do better than any other age class of translocated slow-worms. This needs to be studied further, but in populations I translocated in Kent I found the translocated adults had disappeared within three years, but there was recruitment into the adult age class from these new babies. Therefore if a translocation is absolutely necessary, it should be preformed after mating and before praturition. and kiss the females goodbye. Dr. Renata Platenberg Reptile ecologist |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Betty: my own observations support this view as well. With regards to British legislation this suggests that translocating slow-worms could be considered an offence since it will result in the death of translocated animals. Remember the legislation protects individual animals, not populations or habitat (for widespread reptile species). We need to collect rigorous data that is open to peer scrutiny. Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Unless there can be a demonstrable gain in terms of off-site habitat enhancement works or habitat creation, then retaining the population on site should be the preferred option (again with appropriate habitat enhancement works). Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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Tony Phelps Forum Specialist Joined: 09 Mar 2003 No. of posts: 575 View other posts by Tony Phelps |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 It seems we have a Catch 22 situation when it comes to translocation of reptiles. I have had problems with such mitigation knowing it to be an animal welfare problem rather than anything to do with conservation strategy. However, it appears to have become the norm for developers with the OK by EN. I feel too little is done to establish setaside/management/conservation areas on any proposed development, after all the idea is to put as many dwellings on the area as possible leaving little choice but to establish a suitably 'close' receptor site. We all know that thousands of reptiles have been moved over the last few years. Where are the budgets to monitor the receptor site post-release? and who pays? On one important site in Dorset I have undertaken such monitoring at my own expense, and even where we do get a budget its too little too late wrong time of year etc. Strangely enough the strongest protests about translocations in the 1970's came from EN, (Then Nature Conservacy Council). This however was mainly concerning smooth snake, sand lizard and natterjack. Then, how much do we know about reptile behaviour? In all my years in the field here in the UK and overseas, I have the overall impression that some species do have a strong sense of homebase. Site fidelity is a constant feature here for adder, smooth snake, and slow worm. I am in agreement that immature and sub-adults fare better due to successful conspecific scent trailing, i.e. they can adapt better. Grass snakes are difficult to monitor but I have recorded the same females returning to the same egg-laying sites for many years. I have a paper in press which deals with Spatial distribution and population dynamics of the adder which clearly shows that in a large area of habitat there may be a number of autonomous subpopulations which have been stable for many years (over three decades in this case.) So, I feel the whole mitigation strategy needs a rethink, yes, we are proclaiming a death sentence on a proportion of 'rescues' - so whats the answer? Tony PS Adult slow worms DO eat little ones> |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 Monitoring of translocated individuals must be built into the contract. I think that it is the responsibility of consultants to refuse to accept contracts from developers who will not fund appropriate monitoring. I know that they will always find somebody to do the work on the cheap however... Translocation is a dirty word now for reptiles (I think that amphibian work is much easier to 'engineer'). Far too many consultants who are inexperienced and frankly incompetent are undertaking projects. Often consultants cannot actually do the work themselves and farm it out to university students and the like. The client is paying a professional fee for sub-standard work (although as far as they are concerned so long as a piece of paper states that animals are gone why worry?). I also too often see good reptile sites used as dumping grounds for translocated animals - often at the suggestion of local authorities. Only recently a 'bucketful' of lizards were dumped onto a site in NW Kent by an individual involved in a translocation who had no permission to even be on the site, let alone release animals. I honestly believe that the time has come for EN to consider licensing mitigation work for all reptiles. At the very least we need clear best practice guidelines that are sanctioned and preferably published by EN (I know about the 1998 HGBI guidelines). The lack of regulation and resulting free for all is really quite disturbing. Lee PS yes I agree adult slow-worms will eat youngsters and they should be kept separate. Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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David Bird Forum Specialist Joined: 17 Feb 2003 No. of posts: 515 View other posts by David Bird |
Posted: 28 Aug 2003 I agree with what you say Lee and have told Tony many times that it is up to him to thrash out an agreement and managed land from the developer as he is the herpetological consultant and one doing the work. No developer is going to spend money out willingly on a wildlife project unless told that they have to. The problem here in Dorset that it is not the cheaper so called cowboy worker that is the problem but the ones charging the most that seem to have a bottomless pit for the common species. Despite many enquiries I have only been able to find a few areas that have had any management work to increase habitat and holding capacity so that they may be used for the translocations. Translocations must work in some cases otherwise the recovery programs, reintoductions and introductions that have been carried out in the past with the rare species would not have been so successful as they have been. The Smooth Snake translocations have mostly been carried out with adults in the cases I have known about. British Herpetological Society Librarian and member of B.H.S Conservation Committee. Self employed Herpetological Consultant and Field Worker. |
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Tony Phelps Forum Specialist Joined: 09 Mar 2003 No. of posts: 575 View other posts by Tony Phelps |
Posted: 29 Aug 2003 Where I work directly as the only consultant I do manage to get satisfactory arrangements, but these are usually small contracts involving small areas wher the animals can be absorbed in the immediate local area. The problem comes when I am working as sub-contractor for a large outfit. There is the eternal triangle, the developer, the consultancy, English Nature, and me in the middle. You have to fight for survey time to establish receptor areas, it gets silly, they offer three days in July! and I always come back and insist, NO, sufficient time in Spring please. I have held up several developments this way, and in one case I was offered an 'incentive' to allow the first strategy. It is a currupt world out there. I also refuse to do destructive searches, and anything else that eases the concience of developers. I have now lost work because of my demands for more time, it is not a demand for more money, just an attempt to get the job done right. And yes, you are right, there will be more inexperienced people to take my place. In the meantime I guess that I am in line for critisism if I toe the line, but believe me I do get tough, and it has cost me. You are all aware of my critisism of EN management, and that also has cost me, but I know I am right, I see the results and voice my findings. What more can I do? Tony |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 29 Aug 2003 Yes translocations and introductions can work when sufficient effort is expended to prepare a site and monitor the fate of new populations with ongoing management work as necessary. However, for the widespread species this rarely happens as part of a development mitigation. I also agree that it is the large consultancies who are often the worse offenders. After all these outfits employ staff and run offices. They are in it for the cash, not necessarily the welfare of the animals or conservation. If a company gets too choosy over what work it undertakes, clients will go elsewhere and the company is likely to find itself out of business. What we need is a level playing field. And this is where licensing and best practice guidelines come in. Wearing my consultancy hat I can confirm that I am often outbid on projects by other outfits who are prepared to complete work to the client's requirements, rather than implementing a well developed conservation based strategy. Luckily as a single outfit I can afford to loose such work (there's a lot of development in SE England...). However, if I was an employer and the livelihood of my staff depended on me bringing in cash, could I afford to be so ethical. I believe that many companies cannot. David, the bottomless pit you mention is quite evident in Kent as well. It is these large outfits who often outsource the work to individuals who are less than able. Again, what company can afford to turn away work? Lee Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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calumma Senior Member Joined: 27 Jun 2003 No. of posts: 351 View other posts by calumma |
Posted: 29 Aug 2003 Tony: I have also been in the eternal triangle situation that you describe and find my ability to get things done to a satisfactory standard (based on my conservation objectives) very difficult. However, I now (like you it seems  ) assert my authority on even these projects and I am quite prepared to walk away if the client (developer or other consultant) refuses to play ball.
The problem (as you indicate) is often one of timing. What we need is a thorough review of the planning system (I'm nothing if not ambitious). At the very least we need to press for protected species issues to be taken into consideration early in the planning process. The Cornwall bat case has given me new hope that this is achievable. However, I do not know of a single authority in Kent who includes protected species as a tick box on outline planning applications. Believe me I am working on this. Lee ps. Yes I also recognise the incentive approach  Lee Brady Kent Herpetofauna Recorder | Independent Ecological Consultant |
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Maricia Member Joined: 17 Sep 2003 No. of posts: 3 View other posts by Maricia |
Posted: 17 Sep 2003 Whilst on holiday in Cornwall, my son-in-law came back from his coastal path run with a slow worm as none of us had seen one. He studied bioloy at University & thought this was a female slow worm & looking as though it could be pregnant. Sure enough, the next morning she produced 5 offspring & by the next day we had 11 of them. My 2 grandchildren (5 & 2) were totally fascinated with them. We have brought 2 of them home, having returned the rest & mother to their original habitat. They are in a large plastic bowl with greenery & shells, etc. We have given them some small grubs. Can these be kept as pets? Could some of you knowledgeable people give us some advice. We would rather like to follow their progress. |
- slow worm bith rates |