RAUK - Archived Forum - why is it a different colour

I have just noticed that toads (or frogs, correct me if I'm wrong) have started their mating in my pond.  Can anyone tell me about why the mating pairs seem to be pale with dark spots but they are being harrassed by dark green/grey uniform (ished) coloured animals.  Also, how long does it take for a toad to mate, there was one pair at it in my pond for at least half an hour, (my boyfriend was getting embarrassed!).  My palmate newts are back too and I am concerned that it is too early for either the toads or the newts to mate yet, is there anything I can do to make sure of a successful outcome, or should I just leave them all to it?

Thanks for the info Caleb, I am in the South West (about 10 miles from Lands End).

I have loads more questions, just to start: how many males can a female cope with?  We were watching the toads today and as far as we could make out there were at least five males clinging on to one female (she's a very big girl) and there were at least two more trying to get in on the action.  My mum wondered whether we should have intervened as the lady toad was so overwhelmed but my feeling was that she must be the 'alpha' female and therefore able to cope with whatever.  What do you think?

Also, in order to look at the toads, we have been shining torches in the water, does this disturb them?  It certainly seems to attract their attention.  I am new to this and I don't want to upset what seems to be a successful breeding site in my garden.

I'll hop in and answer this if I may...

This is all perfectly normal Toad breeding behaviour.

There are almost always many more males than females when amphibians are breeding - it's part of the process of natural selection in that the strongest most persistent male gets the gal.

Quietly observing the the animals with torches should be fine - they have other things on their mind right now and aren't so shy as the rest of the year.  However, you should never try to separate breeding frogs or toads as you might injure either or both of the animals in the process (the males have phenomenal grip).  I have heard that occasionally, an unfortunate female will drown due to the sheer number of suitors piling on top of her and forcing her under the water for long periods, but itÆs still best to leave well alone.

By the way, I am from Scotland and have seen male Palmate newts in ponds in full breeding condition in late December early January too.

Thanks Caleb and Donny,

Some more questions!

How can youtell if a palmate newt is ready to breed?  And what is the difference between male and female?  Is it colour, shape, size, markings? 

I also have a very weird coloured newt (at least one) in my pond which I would describe as 'albino', it looks very creamy/white from above, not just on the belly.

How can you tell the difference between a male and female toad?  It is easy to see the difference when they are actually at it as the female is so clearly bigger, but I keep seeing toads of similar size trying to get it together and giving up.  Is this because a male has approached an unready/juvenile female or is it because they have just tried it on with another male toad and realised it won't work?

My mum has just had a pond built as she was so jealous of mine last year!  What can I safely give her from my pond to help to populate hers?  The most important thing for both of us is not to upset the balance in my established pond. 

Also, on a technical note, my photos seem to have made the screen really hard to see properly, does anyone know what I have done wrong and how I can correct it?

Images display best on here when kept below about 700-800 pixels width. They can be resized or cropped in a photo editor. Unfortunately the forum software isn't smart enough to resize the images like some forums will. If you don't have the software to do this let me know and I will edit the image from this end so it fits OK.

At this time of year male toads have what look like black pads on their thumbs, females don't have these. It is actually a collection of tiny black spines that are only present on males in the breeding season, it helps them hang onto the females. Most females will have a male in 'amplexus' if they are anywhere near your pond so I guess any that are not paired are males. (I've not seen immature females arrive at a breeding pond, I think they have more sense, but you often see immature males trying their luck with little success..)

Male toads will grab anything that moves during the breeding season, frogs, your fingers, passing goldfish and other male toads. Fortunately for toads the males have a release call (you may hear it sometimes it is more high pitched than the usual croaks and repeated rapidly). This lets the other toad know its mistake.

Thanks Gemma,  I have managed to change the image.

I shall have a good giggle later when I am watching the males 'grab anything that moves' and I shall listen out for the release call.

Can someone tell me if the one in the top of the following image is a frog?  I think three frogs have appeared tonight, I noticed them first because they were making a completely different noise to the toads and when I looked more closely their skin texture is completely different: glossy and smooth.

I have also taken a picture of the 'albino' newt, it's not a brilliant picture but it does represent the difference in colour between the odd one and a 'normal' newt.  Any info would be great!

Hi again,

The lighter coloured newt is a female, compared to the males they tend to be lighter (particularly in torch light), plumper and do not have a crest. If you have mostly males at the moment (they often arrive in advance of most of the females) this may be why it  appears different to your other newts.

From your replies Caleb, I am guessing that you are very experienced in handling toads and frogs and that as someone who has barely touched either I should leave them alone to sort themselves out. 

Thanks again for all the info, I'm sure it won't be too long before I have more stupid questions!

OK, another stupid question!  Do female toads flirt?  I have just seen the big female in my pond swim around and casually/flirtilly touch a few males.  She only has one male on her at the moment.  Is she looking for more?

Also, the activity tonight is substantially less than it was over the last few nights. I think it is a bit colder tonight (but not really cold) and there is also a full moon (or nearly one anyway), would either factor affect the breding process? 

We actually have two ponds, both are man made and connected with a small artificial stream.  The biggest pond is not very big, about 5ft wide and 7ft long.  We are in a fairly rural location and have a small river at the bottom of the garden. 

We moved into the house in April 06 and although I have no idea when the ponds were built they don't look all that old.  The lining on the bigger pond looks quite good, the small one may be a bit older and you can barely see into the water it is so murky, but they both seem to have been left alone for quite some time as both were quite overgrown.  We found the newts long before we realised we also had a fish!  We cleaned up the big pond a bit in the autumn, after the newts had hibernated, and luckily this doesn't seem to have done any harm.

My mum is dead jealous so she has built a pond herself this autumn!  The thing we are not sure about is what we can put in her pond from my pond to try to populate hers and when to do it.

Hi Kate

I tis great to hear about your toads, frogs and newts and it is very interesting to hear about their activities - I am currently in contact with people in Cornwall who would like to help with the Cornwall Amphibian & Reptile Group - would you be interested in this group?

Also pm me if you would like to know any details of events that CARG will be running this year - you would be welcome to attend to meet like minded people and to learn more about amphibians and reptiles in Cornwall.

It is interesting to see that Toads are using a garden pond - in Jersey the common toad are adapted to using garden ponds - and it seems that Cornwall have similar environmental conditions to Jersey - they also have only one newt species and the toads breed very early - their peak is in the middle of February

Surveyors are out in Jersey now looking for toads which had already started by the same time as your toads Kate

Regards

J

I am very worried, it looks to me like the frogs are trying to kill off the toads by hanging on to the females.  Is this possible?  I have found two frogs (the most frogs I have seen so far this year has been three) clinging to toads tonight and we found a dead female toad at the bottom of the pond on Saturday morning.

I was so worried about this girl tonight that I fished her and her attached males out of the water.  I put them about 6 inches from the water's edge and when I went back, about 15 mins later, the male toad had detached himself and was heading back to the pond but the frog was still attached to the female toad and they were headed away from the pond.  I didn't try to detatch the males as I don't think I am experienced enough to try to do something like that without causing harm.